Tubes on frame

[JohnC]

Hi All,

While looking under the hood today getting ready to do the exhaust, I noticed strapped to the frame on the passenger side, 3 tubes, about 1/4" to 3/8" wide, open ended on the side near the firewall. What are these for. I don't see it in the manual or online.

Thanks

[Barry Wolk]

Vacuum lines for the washer and wiper circuits.

[JohnC]

Thanks Barry. Anoher question on the wiper circuit....is it a hose or a tube from the vacuum pump to the washer bottle?

[Barry Wolk]

All of the vacuum and sprayer lines transfer to steel pipe in the area of the exhaust manifold. The heat would bake rubber hose. If I recall correctly one tube is for vacuum pump vacuum to the wiper motor and through the firewall into the interior. The second is the vacuum signal from the spray coordinator and the third is the pressurized sprayer hose off the washer bottle. If you're replacing hoses make sure they have raised ribs, denoting that they are vacuum, not pressure hoses. People often use heater hose for the big lines, but they will collapse when hot.

[Barry Wolk]

Maybe I misunderstood your question. There is a hard pipe out of the vacuum pump. That travels in hose to a T that runs to the washer bottle and then in hose to the pipe on the frame.

[JohnC]

Thanks again...the info here is amazing

[Barry Wolk]

Vacuum pump.

25352

[Barry Wolk]

Here's a color-coded diagram I did to better help this that have trouble following B&W drawings.

https://www.markiiforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2598&d=1302704621

[JohnC]

While working on the car today, using this diagram, I saw the hose from the manifold to the treadle vac was there but someone plugged the check valve for the hose that goes to the vacuum storage tank. I have a feeling a lot of vac lines are missing. This drawing will help sort this out.

Thanks

[Barry Wolk]

The vacuum storage tank in the frame may have a leak. The leaks are usually in the bottom of tank where water collects. that valve and system is important, but most don't work because the rubber on the stopper is too hard. I'm thinking about trying a handle-dip as an exterior coating.

[JohnC]

So, I went under the car today to locate the vacuum storage tank, found it, then found a hose connected to it which is strange because there is no hose coming from the booster to the storage tank. So following the hose, it is connected to the water pump. So obviously this is not the right water pump in the car. This water pump has another opening under the bypass tube. Somebody hacked the crap out of this car. Check out the pics. Makes me crazy. So as a temporary fix, can the additional hose on the pump be disconnected and plugged while i sort out the vacuum hoses?

Thanks25376 25377 25378

[Pat Marshall]

I believe the two of the three metal lines that run on the passenger side are steel vacuum lines. The third is a copper water line.

[Barry Wolk]

So, I went under the car today to locate the vacuum storage tank, found it, then found a hose connected to it which is strange because there is no hose coming from the booster to the storage tank. So following the hose, it is connected to the water pump. So obviously this is not the right water pump in the car. This water pump has another opening under the bypass tube. Somebody hacked the crap out of this car. Check out the pics. Makes me crazy. So as a temporary fix, can the additional hose on the pump be disconnected and plugged while i sort out the vacuum hoses?

Thanks25376 25377 25378

You're saying the rubber hose from the RH water control is hooked to the tank in the frame? Whats hooked to the RH heater core? If you suck the water out of the vacuum tank you can restore the function of the reserve, maybe two stored power stabs at the brake pedal. That rubber hose on the water pump is supposed to hook to a metal hose strapped to the side of the block. It us supposed to have a vacuum valve on the end of the pipe.

Yes, someone was very confused about how things work.

[JohnC]

Barry...So the hose under the by pass tube is supposed to be there? (Heater outlet Hose? according to the manual) hooked to a tube on the motor? I will look tomorrow on what is hooked up to the heater core. I'll keep ya posted ....thanks for your feed back....I got a lot of homework to do:D

[JohnC]

So I confirmed that the hose is definitely running from the water pump to the vacuum storage tank. The tube on the driver side of the engine block is open and after looking at the pic (included) is blocked and both my heater cores have no hoses connected at all. If anyone has a diagram of how all this is supposed to be hooked up the right way, I would love it so I can get all this right. When I had my 69 GTO as a kid, with no extra money, I assumed that we did anything we could to make it run. It seems like that was the plan for this car.

25399 Hose at the Pump

25400 Hose from pump to storage tank

25403 25405 This where the hose is supposed to hook to with a vacuum valve at the end of the pipe?

Thanks again

[Barry Wolk]

Looks like no harm with the heater pipe hooked to the vacuum tank, but that's real dumb. Get 1 or 2-wire hydraulic hose to replace the heater hose. It won't collapse under vacuum. Try and remove the nut on the check valve. You'll see a simple plunger head down by a spring. The manifold vacuum attached to the nut port and the tank hooks to the fitting that points down. The plunger is rubber that hardens and gets stuck in place by engine vapors and time. Thus valve id pulled against by engine vacuum, entering the booster for use when called for. The reserve is charged at the same time. In the event of a stalled engine you'd have no power brakes at all. When the vacuum from the engine is gone the spring-loaded valve slams shut and the reserve becomes the source of enough vacuum to give you two power brake stops. It works better on the poppet valve boosters as the sleeve-valve units like mine are a large vacuum leak in use. On a sleeve unit you can hear the hissing and the engine flutter and on a poppet there's none of that, but they are more "grabby" with the more-positive poppet valves. The biggest mistake I've seen is people replacing the C-shaped vacuum line inside the booster with fuel or water line, not realizing those hoses are for pressure and collapse under vacuum, negating your power brakes. The original hoses were a cast rubber. I've used single start hydraulic hose that I got to form, somewhat, with repeated baking. An original hose is better.

The two water hoses should have vacuum activated water valves, one for each side. The driver's side comes from the block (or the head) and the other feed from the water pump. When your thermostat, in the driver's side ductwork, is activated by a pull wire from the temperature selector opens the water valves that are supposed to provide equal water pressure to both sides. Each core has an output that T's with the other and returns to be reheated. I, personally, would pay my initial attention to the brakes. The Mark II has great brakes if you start with new drum and new shoes, designed for each other. Putting worn drums on new shoes is a recipe for burned shoes. New and old are different arcs and little initial contact is made, hence the burned material many people think are bad brakes when it was just bad choices.

[JohnC]

So there supposed to be tubes on both sides of the engine block with 2 water valves. I'm missing the tube on the right side of the block (from the pump) can I use copper? On the left side of the block the tube is cut short. Can it be coupled and extended?

[Barry Wolk]

Yes, the tube can be copper. I believe that 1/2" electrical conduit is about the same size. Yes, you should be able to adapt the vacuum-controlled water valves to any kind of conduit. Do you have a Mark II parts book? The drawings for the system are quite good.

[JohnC]

Awesome...thanks again...

I have the technical data manual on my desk to keep clean and a dirty copy in the garage and I downloaded this:

https://www.lincolnoldparts.com/pdf/parts-books/1956-1958-Lincoln-Parts.pdf

Any other downloads or manuals I shouls have?

[Barry Wolk]

Does your car have a/c?

The Mark II specific parts book is better as it filters out all the unnecessary Lincoln parts.

[JohnC]

No AC....do you have a link so I can grab this Mark II book...love to have it

[Barry Wolk]

25418

Yes, look for this.

[JohnC]

Got it. Will do!!

[Roger Zimmermann]

If you don't find one (it would surprise me), I have one I don't use anymore. Shipping from Switzerland should not be excessive.

[JohnC]

Thanks Roger, found one on ebay...it's on the way

[JohnC]

Yes, the tube can be copper. I believe that 1/2" electrical conduit is about the same size. Yes, you should be able to adapt the vacuum-controlled water valves to any kind of conduit. Do you have a Mark II parts book? The drawings for the system are quite good.

Hey Barry...Recieved my Mark II parts book...no diagrams on the vacuum controlled water valves, heater cores etc. I got the same book you showed me...maybe I' missing something?

[Barry Wolk]

There's one for the heater controls on the console and one for the radiator, but I'm not finding the one I thought I saw. I'll look for one. Sorry. it's a great reference.

[Mark Norris]

I cannot recall ever seeing a diagram of the cooling water or heater water plumbing for our cars so I've made a stab at it ...happy to consider any corrections;

Here is the layout;

25517

Here are the heater water flow paths;

25518

And including the cooling water to the radiator;

25528


PS ...as we all know the vacuum operated heater valve units are infamous for dumping the entire contents of the cooling system out in the middle of the road, it happened to me twice before I found a reliable source for replacements (my advice, don't bother with NOS items as their rubber diaphragms will be too delicate to last).

PPS. be very careful with the heater pipe steel fitting on the passenger side cylinder bank ..they are unobtainable new. Conversely the brass right angle fittings for the heater water pipes are readily available from Mk2 specialists and hydraulics suppliers.

[JohnC]

There's one for the heater controls on the console and one for the radiator, but I'm not finding the one I thought I saw. I'll look for one. Sorry. it's a great reference.

I love the manual...I'll take all the info I can get....Thanks

[JohnC]

I cannot recall ever seeing a diagram of the cooling water or heater water plumbing for our cars so I've made a stab at it ...happy to consider any corrections;

Here is the layout;

25517

Here are the heater water flow paths;

25518

And including the cooling water to the radiator;

25528


PS ...as we all know the vacuum operated heater valve units are infamous for dumping the entire contents of the cooling system out in the middle of the road, it happened to me twice before I found a reliable source for replacements (my advice, don't bother with NOS items as their rubber diaphragms will be too delicate to last).

PPS. be very careful with the heater pipe steel fitting on the passenger side cylinder bank ..they are unobtainable new. Conversely the brass right angle fittings for the heater water pipes are readily available from Mk2 specialists and hydraulics suppliers.

Awesome drawings!! So, metal tubes from the engine block to the water valves on both sides and also metal tubing from the water pump to the heater cores on both sides. The driver side of the water pump has a brass fitting on the pump to connect a tube to the heater core too? I'm going to have to look closer at mine but I'm sure it's misssing on mine

[Mark Norris]

Hi John, yes that's correct. The metal tubes are unique to the Mk2 I believe so if a prior owner of your car removed some (say corroded out) then to get new old ones you could go to one of the specialist who has parting out cars (I know Jack R. at MarkIIEnterprises has a number of parting out MK2's behind the premises) or perhaps have some made in stainless (someone on the Forum might have done this).

[Barry Wolk]

Your drawing is excellent. it would help some if you expanded the circuit to show the lever control moving the water valve control/thermostat in the LH duct controlling the water valves.

Here are some photos of the mandrel-bent tubes. Easy to duplicate. The fittings are off the shelf. I believe the water valve end might just be a copper water fitting.

25529

25530

[JohnC]

So, I went under the hood and the car today and this is what I have:
On the passenger side of the water pump, I have a hose that runs to the vacuum storage tank{SMH}
On the driver side of the water pump I do have a metal tube, run down and back up and out past the engine block with nothing connected.
I don't have any tubes connected to the block like the drawing has. Where do they get connected too. I found these under the car:

25531 In front of the motor mount on the passenger side

25532 Behind the oil filter on the driver side.

What am I looking at?

[Barry Wolk]

Block drains.

[JohnC]

Block drains.

Alrighty...then thats not it...I won't touch those

[Mark Norris]

Your drawing is excellent. it would help some if you expanded the circuit to show the lever control moving the water valve control/thermostat in the LH duct controlling the water valves.

Here are some photos of the mandrel-bent tubes. Easy to duplicate. The fittings are off the shelf. I believe the water valve end might just be a copper water fitting.

25529

25530

The first photograph shows the unobtainable steel fitting I mentioned before. Be very careful if you ever have to remove it and make sure the antifreeze has corrosion inhibitor in it.

I've never actually seen the vacuum thermostat valve since its hidden away in the ducting (I guess beside the footwell?). I assume the hot air passes over it and if its too hot the vacuum to the brass valve is reduced so closing it a little and reducing the water flow to both heater matrixes? (or should I say matrices). Its funny that it took car designers decades to realize that its cheaper, quicker and easier to regulate heater output by controlling the air flow through the heater matrix rather than the water flow rate though it.

[Mark Norris]

So, I went under the hood and the car today and this is what I have:
On the passenger side of the water pump, I have a hose that runs to the vacuum storage tank{SMH}
On the driver side of the water pump I do have a metal tube, run down and back up and out past the engine block with nothing connected.
I don't have any tubes connected to the block like the drawing has. Where do they get connected too. I found these under the car:

25531 In front of the motor mount on the passenger side

25532 Behind the oil filter on the driver side.

What am I looking at?

Hi John, it seems the heater pipework has been removed and messed about with by a prior owner. There is no reason why the water pump suction side should be connected to the vacuum tank! The drivers side seems to have been plugged up probably because the vacuum valve failed (dumping the coolant on the ground) so the owner just removed everything in frustration. I guess some of the fittings locations on the engine have been fitted with 3/8" NPT threaded plugs. You can probably get a pipework set from Jack R. including new brass fittings and vacuum valves and MarkIIEnterprises ..it won't be cheap. The vacuum valves can also be purchased from Dennis Carpenter (about $95 each) since they are also used on Thunderbirds of that era.

The right angle brass fittings are 3/8" NPT male by 7/8-18 UNS-2B 5/8" INVERTED FLARE female, available from hydraulics suppliers or get them from Jack R.

Having said all that the vacuum control thermostat valve might also be missing and I understand thats a lot harder to find (Barry might have some information).

[JohnC]

Hi John, it seems the heater pipework has been removed and messed about with by a prior owner. There is no reason why the water pump suction side should be connected to the vacuum tank! The drivers side seems to have been plugged up probably because the vacuum valve failed (dumping the coolant on the ground) so the owner just removed everything in frustration. I guess some of the fittings locations on the engine have been fitted with 3/8" NPT threaded plugs. You can probably get a pipework set from Jack R. including new brass fittings and vacuum valves and MarkIIEnterprises ..it won't be cheap. The vacuum valves can also be purchased from Dennis Carpenter (about $95 each) since they are also used on Thunderbirds of that era.

The right angle brass fittings are 3/8" NPT male by 7/8-18 UNS-2B 5/8" INVERTED FLARE female, available from hydraulics suppliers or get them from Jack R.

Having said all that the vacuum control thermostat valve might also be missing and I understand thats a lot harder to find (Barry might have some information).

Great info...yes, whoever had the car before really butchered it up... not the guy I bought it from, he had no interest in getting the car back to normal and sat for years....anyway...where would these brass fittings located on the block? Is it near or under the manifold. Thank you for your help and knowledge...much appreciated

[Mark Norris]

Here is the link to the vacuum valves of which you'll need two;

https://www.dennis-carpenter.com/cars/heater-amp-ac/heater-control-valve/b5a-18495-a-heater-valve-assembly-in-block

This the link for the vacuum thermostat control valve which is operated from a cable/lever from the control consol, this is the valve Barry mentioned;

https://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?Parta~ShowPicTxt~Z5Z5Z50000129a~Z5Z5Z5AAAHV

Here are the brass elbows, you'll need three.

https://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000129a~Z5Z5Z5173~P2 5.00~~~~S6A806TFB686173203080b~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z5000012 9A

Before all this though make sure you can get or make a set of tubes.

The 5/8" ID heater water hosing is easily found at any car parts store.

The 90 degree brass connector on the drivers side of the engine is screwed into a 3/8" NPT port in the side of the cylinder header head between the front and next exhaust header connections. Can only be fitted with the exhaust header removed if I recall correctly.

Similarly the straight steel fitting on the passenger side screws into a 3/8" NPT port in the side of the cylinder head between the rear and second from rear exhaust header connections. Again most easily fitted with the exhaust header removed.

Note originally the exhaust headers did not have gaskets at their connection to the cylinder heads but I think most owners fit gaskets these days.

I'll take some photos for the 90 degree brass fittings at the water pump suction side.

[JohnC]

Here is the link to the vacuum valves of which you'll need two;

https://www.dennis-carpenter.com/cars/heater-amp-ac/heater-control-valve/b5a-18495-a-heater-valve-assembly-in-block

This the link for the vacuum thermostat control valve which is operated from a cable/lever from the control consol, this is the valve Barry mentioned;

https://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?Parta~ShowPicTxt~Z5Z5Z50000129a~Z5Z5Z5AAAHV

Here are the brass elbows, you'll need three.

https://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000129a~Z5Z5Z5173~P2 5.00~~~~S6A806TFB686173203080b~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z5000012 9A

Before all this though make sure you can get or make a set of tubes.

The 5/8" ID heater water hosing is easily found at any car parts store.

The 90 degree brass connector on the drivers side of the engine is screwed into a 3/8" NPT port in the side of the cylinder header head between the front and next exhaust header connections. Can only be fitted with the exhaust header removed if I recall correctly.

Similarly the straight steel fitting on the passenger side screws into a 3/8" NPT port in the side of the cylinder head between the rear and second from rear exhaust header connections. Again most easily fitted with the exhaust header removed.

Note originally the exhaust headers did not have gaskets at their connection to the cylinder heads but I think most owners fit gaskets these days.

I'll take some photos for the 90 degree brass fittings at the water pump suction side.

Wow...thank you for this...I'd hug ya if there wasn't an ocean between us

[Barry Wolk]

I'm a pretty expert conduit bender, but this takes a mandrel bender. This wraps around the fuel/vacuum pump. You might want to try and locate a direct replacement.

This is the same size as 1/2" EMT (electrical metallic tubing) which has a similar zinc finish, inside and out.

https://www.vwvortex.com/cdn-cgi/image/format=auto,onerror=redirect,width=1920,height=192 0,fit=scale-down/https://www.vwvortex.com/attachments/img_3149-jpg.165998/

[JohnC]

I'm a pretty expert conduit bender, but this takes a mandrel bender. This wraps around the fuel/vacuum pump. You might want to try and locate a direct replacement.

This is the same size as 1/2" EMT (electrical metallic tubing) which has a similar zinc finish, inside and out.

https://www.vwvortex.com/cdn-cgi/image/format=auto,onerror=redirect,width=1920,height=192 0,fit=scale-down/https://www.vwvortex.com/attachments/img_3149-jpg.165998/

That pipe look awesome.. Did you bend that one?..I recongnize this tube since it's the only one still attached to the water pump in my car but nothing attached on the other end. So can all the tubes be made from EMT??..this looks like this would be the toughest one to bend

[Mark Norris]

Here are a few photos of the brass and steel fittings in place and the steel pipes etc.

25562

Brass 90 degree fitting connecting the passenger side heater matrix to the suction side of the water pump;

25555

The steel pipe running from the outlet of the passenger side heater matrix to the suction side of the water pump;

25556

The steel fitting (unobtainable) connecting the short steel pipe from vacuum valve to the passenger side cylinder head, this is where the passenger side heater matrix is fed from;

25557

The other end of the short steel pipe on the passenger side has the vacuum operated water valve to feed the heater matrix on that side (note the brass hex union half fixed (silver soldered?) to the end of the steel pipe ..they come as one item);

25558

The drivers side is a lot more difficult to photograph because the air box ducting gets in the way. There is a 90 degree brass fitting below the steering pump screwed into the back of the water pump (suction side) and this connects the long complex shaped steel tube in Barry's photo in the previous post to the pump. At the other end of this pipe there is a heater hose that connects it to the outlet of the driver's side heater matrix.

The inlet to this heater matrix is fed from another 90 degree brass fitting on the driver's side cylinder head connected to a medium length steel pipe then onto the driver's side vacuum valve (you can just see it on the left of the photo), then by rubber hose to the inlet of the heater matrix. You can see this steel pipe running alongside the exhaust header in the following photo;

25559

If you go down the route of making your own steel pipes then you'll need the union nuts, available from several suppliers like this one (be careful on alignment when screwing them in because they cross thread pretty easily);

25560

The steel fitting on the passenger side is unobtainable (please someone prove me wrong) but to can get a brass version but it would need re-machining to change the 1/2" NPT to 3/8" NPT assuming the ID was small enough to do that (otherwise you'll need to add a 1/2" NPT female to 3/8" NPT male (not pretty since the overall fitting will be quite long));

25561

...you'll save yourself a lot of hassle if you simply find you can buy a set of second hand steel pipes from Jack R. at MarkII Enterprises or Old Lincoln etc.

[Barry Wolk]

...you'll save yourself a lot of hassle if you simply find you can buy a set of second hand steel pipes from Jack R. at MarkII Enterprises or Old Lincoln etc.

Absolutely concur.

However, my machine shop has made very similar flared fittings for me over the years. They are so simple a device that the CNC programming time would be negligible. I can get a quote if you can't find them.

John, here's a photo of the pipes on the frame for your reference.

25572

Also, Mark, do you know the builder of the Droop-Snoot Jag tribute car?

Mark, do you know the specifics of the flare angles?

[JohnC]

Here are a few photos of the brass and steel fittings in place and the steel pipes etc.

25562

Brass 90 degree fitting connecting the passenger side heater matrix to the suction side of the water pump;

25555

The steel pipe running from the outlet of the passenger side heater matrix to the suction side of the water pump;

25556

The steel fitting (unobtainable) connecting the short steel pipe from vacuum valve to the passenger side cylinder head, this is where the passenger side heater matrix is fed from;

25557

The other end of the short steel pipe on the passenger side has the vacuum operated water valve to feed the heater matrix on that side (note the brass hex union half fixed (silver soldered?) to the end of the steel pipe ..they come as one item);

25558

The drivers side is a lot more difficult to photograph because the air box ducting gets in the way. There is a 90 degree brass fitting below the steering pump screwed into the back of the water pump (suction side) and this connects the long complex shaped steel tube in Barry's photo in the previous post to the pump. At the other end of this pipe there is a heater hose that connects it to the outlet of the driver's side heater matrix.

The inlet to this heater matrix is fed from another 90 degree brass fitting on the driver's side cylinder head connected to a medium length steel pipe then onto the driver's side vacuum valve (you can just see it on the left of the photo), then by rubber hose to the inlet of the heater matrix. You can see this steel pipe running alongside the exhaust header in the following photo;

25559

If you go down the route of making your own steel pipes then you'll need the union nuts, available from several suppliers like this one (be careful on alignment when screwing them in because they cross thread pretty easily);

25560

The steel fitting on the passenger side is unobtainable (please someone prove me wrong) but to can get a brass version but it would need re-machining to change the 1/2" NPT to 3/8" NPT assuming the ID was small enough to do that (otherwise you'll need to add a 1/2" NPT female to 3/8" NPT male (not pretty since the overall fitting will be quite long));

25561

...you'll save yourself a lot of hassle if you simply find you can buy a set of second hand steel pipes from Jack R. at MarkII Enterprises or Old Lincoln etc.

Thank you amazing info...the one complex piece of tubing is the only one still connected to the car

[JohnC]

So.. I found a plug on the drivers side where the tube should be and located the one on the passenger side....it has a wire coming out if it...huh?...why? The other end wasnt connected to anything....what are people thinking?

25573 passenger side from the top

25574 passenger side from under the manifold

[Barry Wolk]

Looks like a temp sensor. It is in hot water. This is all very interesting. The good thing is that it appears reversible.

[Roger Zimmermann]

As I needed a lot of pictures during the construction of the Mark II scale motor, I just selected 3 which may help. Other pictures are available.

25576 25577 25578

[Mark Norris]

Mark, do you know the specifics of the flare angles?

I have a new flare nut so I should be able to measure the flare angle from it, will take a look tomorrow.

[Mark Norris]

Looks like a temp sensor. It is in hot water. This is all very interesting. The good thing is that it appears reversible.

Agree, looks like a prior owner just screwed in anything they could find that fitted 3/8" NPT.

[Mark Norris]

Also, Mark, do you know the builder of the Droop-Snoot Jag tribute car?

I'm afraid not, actually I've not heard of it.

[Barry Wolk]

3 real cars made. Raced poorly. All destroyed by the factory. The plans survived. A tribute ensued.

[Barry Wolk]

Mark, check this out.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=517612

[Mark Norris]

Mark, check this out.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=517612

Looks like he is doing a lovely and very accurate job of a 1951 Jaguar C-Type. In 1952 Jaguar were hoping to build on the success of the 1951 Lemans effort (where the C-type first appeared). Just before the 1952 Lemans event Stirling Moss had driven a C-type in the Italian Mille Miglia road race and reported back by telegram that the Mercedes cars were much faster on the straights so in a panic rush Jaguar redesigned the bodies (drop snoot with a long flat tail) before they shipped out the cars to France for the race. No time for testing ...oops! In the race they all retired due to overheating because the drop snoop didn't allow enough air to get into the radiator. Altogether a very embarrassing result for Jaguar hence they quickly got rid of the three they built.. Moss got a lot of stick for his report (quite rightly too because it turned out the Mercedes weren't that fast)) and the Jaguar engineers wish they hadn't listened to him.

Actually I'm working on my all alloy C-type replica at the moment converting it to triple weber DCOE 40 carbs which has meant a new cylinder head with fully gas flowed porting. Its what they used in 1953 when they won Lemans. If nothing else the induction roar should be impressive. Then I've got some other work to do (fit correct special series generator, accurate switches, repaint the bonnet etc.) and hopefully have it back on the road later this year ..first time since 1993. Will post a few pictures on the "what else are you working on" thread.

[Mark Norris]

Mark, do you know the specifics of the flare angles?

From what I can find it seems the steel nut has a chamfer of 45 degrees and the receiving female inverted cone is 42 degrees (from parallel), the pipe flare is 42 degrees also so there is a slight crush effect when the nut is tightened up.